Shrapnel wrote:Basically, Fort Max is really a diminutive Cybertronian known as Fortress. He can connect to a larger, lifeless robot - called a "transector" - called Cerebros.
Fortress also has a large spaceship-cruiser/city-base known as Spaceship Bruce Battleship Maximus. The Maximus can also turn into a gigantic transector. When Fortress combines with Cerebros, Cerebros can then in turn transform into the head of Maximus, and thus Fortress Maximus is formed.
So basically he's Tengan Toppa Gurren Lagann's grandpa?
Exactly how big is Fort Max supposed to be? The class combo here gets you up to Colossal+++++, also known in den parlance as Bigmcfuckinglargehuge, or over half a mile tall. At which point your mini is 17' tall. Colossal++ is ~4', or a small child/hired midget. If you want to use the 22" tall toy as a mini, that pegs him around 117' tall in game, or Colossal-ish.
Last edited by Prak on Tue Jan 01, 2013 7:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
Cuz apparently I gotta break this down for you dense motherfuckers- I'm trans feminine nonbinary. My pronouns are they/them.
Winnah wrote:No, No. 'Prak' is actually a Thri Kreen impersonating a human and roleplaying himself as a D&D character. All hail our hidden insect overlords.
FrankTrollman wrote:In Soviet Russia, cosmic horror is the default state.
You should gain sanity for finding out that the problems of a region are because there are fucking monsters there.
Why not build him as a fortress that you take over with Magic Jar? Turn your Colossal castle (built with the rules from Stronghold Builder's Guidebook) into an animated object, hit it with permanency. You need to be 14th level, but you don't need anything other than Wizard levels to pull this off (you do admittedly need to have access to the Chaos Domain, but there are plenty of ways to do that).
Are you thinking of just handwaving the transformation part, Frank?
Cuz apparently I gotta break this down for you dense motherfuckers- I'm trans feminine nonbinary. My pronouns are they/them.
Winnah wrote:No, No. 'Prak' is actually a Thri Kreen impersonating a human and roleplaying himself as a D&D character. All hail our hidden insect overlords.
FrankTrollman wrote:In Soviet Russia, cosmic horror is the default state.
You should gain sanity for finding out that the problems of a region are because there are fucking monsters there.
Vebyast wrote:Here's a fun target for Major Creation: hydrazine. One casting every six seconds at CL9 gives you a bit more than 40 liters per second, which is comparable to the flow rates of some small, but serious, rocket engines. Six items running at full blast through a well-engineered engine will put you, and something like 50 tons of cargo, into space. Alternatively, if you thrust sideways, you will briefly be a fireball screaming across the sky at mach 14 before you melt from atmospheric friction.
fectin wrote:How do you animate your colossal castle?
Get your Animate Objects caster level to 32. You can use chicken death knells or any of a number of other incredibly bullshit tricks, because it only has to stay that way for a few rounds and you're doing this in downtime. You want to do that anyway, because if your caster level is less than 30, your moving castle can be dispelled.
Prak wrote:Are you thinking of just handwaving the transformation part, Frank?
Once you are a Colossal Castle via Magic Jar, you can polymorph your "self".
Cuz apparently I gotta break this down for you dense motherfuckers- I'm trans feminine nonbinary. My pronouns are they/them.
Winnah wrote:No, No. 'Prak' is actually a Thri Kreen impersonating a human and roleplaying himself as a D&D character. All hail our hidden insect overlords.
FrankTrollman wrote:In Soviet Russia, cosmic horror is the default state.
You should gain sanity for finding out that the problems of a region are because there are fucking monsters there.
That's a bit sketchy. It works, but what happens when the duration expires, or you enter an antimagic field? I'm not just quibbling there, I'm literally not sure what happens.
Tangentially related: is there an elegant way to get Permanency as a spell-like?
Vebyast wrote:Here's a fun target for Major Creation: hydrazine. One casting every six seconds at CL9 gives you a bit more than 40 liters per second, which is comparable to the flow rates of some small, but serious, rocket engines. Six items running at full blast through a well-engineered engine will put you, and something like 50 tons of cargo, into space. Alternatively, if you thrust sideways, you will briefly be a fireball screaming across the sky at mach 14 before you melt from atmospheric friction.
fectin wrote:That's a bit sketchy. It works, but what happens when the duration expires, or you enter an antimagic field? I'm not just quibbling there, I'm literally not sure what happens.
I don't understand. What are we concerned about running out of duration on?
Tangentially related: is there an elegant way to get Permanency as a spell-like?
I must admit, I completely forgot that I asked this. Heh.
Prak wrote:Exactly how big is Fort Max supposed to be? The class combo here gets you up to Colossal+++++, also known in den parlance as Bigmcfuckinglargehuge, or over half a mile tall. At which point your mini is 17' tall. Colossal++ is ~4', or a small child/hired midget. If you want to use the 22" tall toy as a mini, that pegs him around 117' tall in game, or Colossal-ish.
Well, lets see... I'd be using the Fort Max toy as the mini... Fort Max's toy is.. 22" tall... so...
Fort Max is really, really tall.
Is this wretched demi-bee
Half asleep upon my knee
Some freak from a menagerie?
No! It's Eric, the half a bee
But how tall is he supposed to be in TF Canon? The wiki didn't really say.
Cuz apparently I gotta break this down for you dense motherfuckers- I'm trans feminine nonbinary. My pronouns are they/them.
Winnah wrote:No, No. 'Prak' is actually a Thri Kreen impersonating a human and roleplaying himself as a D&D character. All hail our hidden insect overlords.
FrankTrollman wrote:In Soviet Russia, cosmic horror is the default state.
You should gain sanity for finding out that the problems of a region are because there are fucking monsters there.
OK I'm being a buzzkill but unless someone can find another loophole, Magic Jarring into an animated object doesn't work since Magic Jar is Necromancy, and constructs are immune to necromancy effects.
If the fortress has a generally humanoid form you can make it an incarnate construct (SS 121), which makes it a giant. Doubles speed, drops Natural Armour by 3, con and int get rolled, Wis and Cha become 3. CR becomes a laughable 5.
Cuz apparently I gotta break this down for you dense motherfuckers- I'm trans feminine nonbinary. My pronouns are they/them.
Winnah wrote:No, No. 'Prak' is actually a Thri Kreen impersonating a human and roleplaying himself as a D&D character. All hail our hidden insect overlords.
FrankTrollman wrote:In Soviet Russia, cosmic horror is the default state.
You should gain sanity for finding out that the problems of a region are because there are fucking monsters there.
CCarter wrote:OK I'm being a buzzkill but unless someone can find another loophole, Magic Jarring into an animated object doesn't work since Magic Jar is Necromancy, and constructs are immune to necromancy effects.
Magic Jar is not a necromancy effect. It's a spell from the necromancy school. In other news, Phantasmal Forces isn't a force effect.
FrankTrollman wrote:
Magic Jar is not a necromancy effect. It's a spell from the necromancy school. In other news, Phantasmal Forces isn't a force effect.
-Username17
What.
Okay, I know that you know what you're talking about, so you're probably technically right somehow, but that is utter bullshit. If the set of spells from the school of necromancy isn't a subset of "necromancy effects", then what does "necromancy effects" even mean?
Last edited by Schleiermacher on Fri Jan 04, 2013 8:14 am, edited 2 times in total.
FrankTrollman wrote:
Magic Jar is not a necromancy effect. It's a spell from the necromancy school. In other news, Phantasmal Forces isn't a force effect.
-Username17
What.
Okay, I know that you know what you're talking about, so you're probably technically right somehow, but that is utter bullshit. If the set of spells from the school of necromancy isn't a subset of "necromancy effects", then what does "necromancy effects" even mean?
Necromancy Effects are things that either specify that they are a necromancy effect, or spells that have the [Necromancy] tag on them. It is an incredibly, absurdly tiny set that is mostly confined to a couple of monster abilities I can't even name off the top of my head.
It's like how the Earth Genasi gets a bonus to saving throws again Earth Spells and effects, a set which includes earthbolt, transmute rock to lava, and... maybe another thing somewhere in the game. Maybe. Some immunities and resistances are poorly thought out and not cross referenced well. A couple spells do "darkness damage" which I think might have one creature in the entire game that actually has any resistance to.
FrankTrollman wrote:
Magic Jar is not a necromancy effect. It's a spell from the necromancy school. In other news, Phantasmal Forces isn't a force effect.
-Username17
What.
Okay, I know that you know what you're talking about, so you're probably technically right somehow, but that is utter bullshit. If the set of spells from the school of necromancy isn't a subset of "necromancy effects", then what does "necromancy effects" even mean?
The "frightful moan" ability of a ghost is specifically tagged as necromantic.
Wasnt the the spell for becoming a door fortress Haunt Shift? Not magic jar?
Red_Rob wrote:
I mean, I'm pretty sure the Mayans had a prophecy about what would happen if Frank and PL ever agreed on something. PL will argue with Frank that the sky is blue or grass is green, so when they both separately piss on your idea that is definitely something to think about.
Korwin wrote:Wasnt the the spell for becoming a door fortress Haunt Shift? Not magic jar?
Only if you don't want to transform into a giant robot. Haunt Shift lets you haunt an object, while an animated object is a creature. To take over creatures, you need Magic Jar.
But if you were OK taking over a castle that then did not get up and walk around, Haunt Shift would work.
Korwin wrote:Wasnt the the spell for becoming a door fortress Haunt Shift? Not magic jar?
Not at all. There is some confusion because stupid Char Opers can't read, but Haunt shift is basically useless for possessing objects that aren't capable of moving on their own.
First off, it is limited to 9HD max. Secondly, any haunting is limited to Huge size at most.
And finally, if you are under 10HD, IE all Haunted Shifts, you can only move parts of the castle that can already move. So basically, unless you can build walking legs onto your fortress, it can't move around. As opposed to Animate + Magic Jar, where is can.
There are still some uses for haunt shifting objects, but I can only think of flywheels or vehicles (boats, sleds).
Spell Stitching only allows conjuration, evocation, and necromancy. Permanency is universal.
Vebyast wrote:Here's a fun target for Major Creation: hydrazine. One casting every six seconds at CL9 gives you a bit more than 40 liters per second, which is comparable to the flow rates of some small, but serious, rocket engines. Six items running at full blast through a well-engineered engine will put you, and something like 50 tons of cargo, into space. Alternatively, if you thrust sideways, you will briefly be a fireball screaming across the sky at mach 14 before you melt from atmospheric friction.
I thought you could only attack creatures with a lifeforce/soul etc with magic jar? Which animated objects lack afaik?
Gary Gygax wrote:The player’s path to role-playing mastery begins with a thorough understanding of the rules of the game
Bigode wrote:I wouldn't normally make that blanket of a suggestion, but you seem to deserve it: scroll through the entire forum, read anything that looks interesting in term of design experience, then come back.
ishy wrote:I thought you could only attack creatures with a lifeforce/soul etc with magic jar? Which animated objects lack afaik?
That's not clear.
You would think so, but there is a MM entry for animated objects, which are explicitly created by the Animate Object spell. So, who knows?
It appears to work short-term at least.
After the duration runs out, I would say (without a lot of explicit rules support), that the object's 'soul' evaporates, and you are now animating it for as long as you stay. If you Jar into a new body, it reverts to being an object, and you can't re-enter it without it getting animated again.
Permanency makes that question go away, but adds a couple new ones and an XP cost. Thus my questions from earlier.
Vebyast wrote:Here's a fun target for Major Creation: hydrazine. One casting every six seconds at CL9 gives you a bit more than 40 liters per second, which is comparable to the flow rates of some small, but serious, rocket engines. Six items running at full blast through a well-engineered engine will put you, and something like 50 tons of cargo, into space. Alternatively, if you thrust sideways, you will briefly be a fireball screaming across the sky at mach 14 before you melt from atmospheric friction.
